Raising The Debt Limit

[betteroffhere]

Good reply and I agree, insanity all around.  Everything, as you noted in a round about way, has a potential or definite consequence.  We opened trade relations and only the savvy knew what was probably coming.  Nafta was not a shining moment for Clinton.  The intention was right, but the reality of what would and did happen f'ed us in more ways than one.

and those are accounted for...

thats how you postion yourself ahead of everyone else who is a mule...

the real estate bubble...it hurt many americans and is still hurting today...but

it hurt more foreign investors...they had the rug pulled right out from under them...

every game is connected...whether its poker...or a shell game...a con...

they rely on similar principals....mostly surrounding greed and promise of better...

an incentive of some type...the fundamentals remain the same...and can be easily

profited from if one knows whether they are at the cards table or the chess board...

however...ignorance is what america has decide to farm in abundance

[Howey]

For all of his blustering and bufferony, McConnell at last has come to the realization the GOP is to blame for this mess...and will most likely pay dearly

http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/171189-mcconnell-gop-wont-take-co-ownership-of-a-bad-economy

[Howey]

Hmmmm...more Americans want a 50/50 split of spending cuts and revenue increases than any other option.

Why won't Congress listen? Of course, we've been clamboring for a jobs bill for 9 months and they didn't listen.


At least today they tried to save the poor endangered incandescent lightbulb from government intrusion!

[ekg]

why wouldn't ask for double...he knows he ain't gonna get it...

he didn't need to ask for double what they were askng for... all he had to do was meet  their number, but he didn't.. he went farther than that because he's not stupid and he knows the cuts are needed.. the Gov't is bloated.

He knew it was going to be hard to get the people who raised the debt limit 10 times in the last 10 years when it was a (R) president, to raise it for him.. it's the same game the GOP has been playing for a cpl years now.. so he countered their offer with double what they were asking for and less than the tax raises his base was asking for.. at that point, the GOP had won. They would ask for $2trillion in cuts and get $4trillion instead.. and they would only have to close the tax-loopholes for oil companies in 2 years, and let the Bush tax-cut expire next year to the tune of >$1trillion in revenue.. it was a win for them. But they didn't budge, why? If not to ensure Obama's one term,  then why?



You've mocked Chuck for his belief  on the GOP's singular goal here, but you accept that it doesn't matter what Obama asks for, he's not going to get it.. so what gives?
 

[betteroffhere]

he didn't need to ask for double what they were askng for... all he had to do was meet  their number, but he didn't.. he went farther than that because he's not stupid and he knows the cuts are needed.. the Gov't is bloated.

He knew it was going to be hard to get the people who raised the debt limit 10 times in the last 10 years when it was a (R) president, to raise it for him.. it's the same game the GOP has been playing for a cpl years now.. so he countered their offer with double what they were asking for and less than the tax raises his base was asking for.. at that point, the GOP had won. They would ask for $2trillion in cuts and get $4trillion instead.. and they would only have to close the tax-loopholes for oil companies in 2 years, and let the Bush tax-cut expire next year to the tune of >$1trillion in revenue.. it was a win for them. But they didn't budge, why? If not to ensure Obama's one term,  then why?



You've mocked Chuck for his belief  on the GOP's singular goal here, but you accept that it doesn't matter what Obama asks for, he's not going to get it.. so what gives?
 

wow...

the first paragraph is telling of YOUR beliefs...what you would imagine to be the perfect answer for the action...could be right...but idk it to be true


number two: shouldn't it be hard for any fucking body to get an increase after ten years of the limit being continuiously raised...jesus...in the middle of

a nightmare recession also...oh...of course not...the whoever is just out to get him...well of course they are...and it works both ways at all times...

with each new proposal or committee etc...everyone is always jockeying for position and leverage...


3. Objection !!!!

the defendant, hereby known in this thread as lilboh, which may or may not qualify as a mock, doesn't believe the one being objected can

provide evidence of the accusation and request that evidence be entered in, formally and published post haste !

[Howey]

wow...

the first paragraph is telling of YOUR beliefs...what you would imagine to be the perfect answer for the action...could be right...but..

provide evidence of the accusation and request that evidence be entered in, formally and published post haste !

lilBoh:

This country has historically raised the debt ceiling nearly every year for 70 something years. During both Republican and Democratic administrations.

Until this year it has always been an affirmative bipartisan vote with minimal dissent. Never has increasing the debt limit been tied to a proposed budget or anything else.

Why? Because it's dealing with money we've ALREADY SPENT. Most of which was spent by the Bush administration, btw.

If the country doesn't pay for what it has already purchased, our credit rating will go to hell in a handbasket and, as has been warned be EVERYONE IN THE FINANCIAL COMMUNITY.

The answer is obvious. Stop the childish posturing, raise the debt limit, and get to work on a new, leaner budget with both spending cuts and revenue gains.

[betteroffhere]

lilBoh:

This country has historically raised the debt ceiling nearly every year for 70 something years. During both Republican and Democratic administrations.

Until this year it has always been an affirmative bipartisan vote with minimal dissent. Never has increasing the debt limit been tied to a proposed budget or anything else.

Why? Because it's dealing with money we've ALREADY SPENT. Most of which was spent by the Bush administration, btw.

If the country doesn't pay for what it has already purchased, our credit rating will go to hell in a handbasket and, as has been warned be EVERYONE IN THE FINANCIAL COMMUNITY.

The answer is obvious. Stop the childish posturing, raise the debt limit, and get to work on a new, leaner budget with both spending cuts and revenue gains.

revenue gains from where...

one in six is on the tax payer tit

20 to 22 million local state and federal empolyees on the tax payer tit...

30 millionish unemployeed...

30 millionish undocumented or illegals in the country having an impact...

i pay self employement taxes...thats .159 percent...bam...for medi and ss

then income tax on earnings...around tenish percent give or take where the deducutions are allowed...

thank goodness i'm poor...i'm only out 26 percent of earnings...for that...

i live in florida so i get to avoid state income taxing and in its place is a tax on goods and services...

of which is .065 where i am...plus the emmbeded tax on each gallon of fuel i purchase...whats that ? 35 cents to a gallon ?

times the number of gallons consumed so i can have earnings...then there's property taxes...municipal,city,blah blah blah

i'm poor and bleeding 40 percent of my earnings already...

lets go fair tax...with a flat rate...price would either not change or go down...once all the emmbedded taxes are removed...

idk...but i do know the current system isn't working for or on my behalf...and shortly won't be working at all

[Howey]

revenue gains from where?

That's easy...and your situation is a perfect example of the problem.

You are a small business owner. Not the kind championed by the GOP...they don't want to know about you.

Revenue can be increased by cutting out the loopholes afforded the "small" businessmen championed by the GOP, oil subsidies for the oil companies, farm subsidies for the corporate farmers, and a whole lot more.

As well as asking the super rich to contribute. Tthey are taxed at the lowest rate in history.

[betteroffhere]

That's easy...and your situation is a perfect example of the problem.

You are a small business owner. Not the kind championed by the GOP...they don't want to know about you.

Revenue can be increased by cutting out the loopholes afforded the "small" businessmen championed by the GOP, oil subsidies for the oil companies, farm subsidies for the corporate farmers, and a whole lot more.

As well as asking the super rich to contribute. Tthey are taxed at the lowest rate in history.

Don't like the fair tax thing huh...

keep grinding it out with the same ol system...

raise taxes on someone...not stop the madness...just control it

i don't think its that easy howie...for the bottom class...sure...they'll get right on that idea

but i don't think the numbers would workout to the peoples benefit...but...then again

it was the people who allowed this to happen...fear is a great motivator

[Howey]

Don't like the fair tax thing huh...

keep grinding it out with the same ol system...

raise taxes on someone...not stop the madness...just control it

i don't think its that easy howie...for the bottom class...sure...they'll get right on that idea

but i don't think the numbers would workout to the peoples benefit...but...then again

it was the people who allowed this to happen...fear is a great motivator

Since I don't pay taxes theres no reason for me to dislike the fair tax concept. But if you think it was devised to benefit anyone but the rich proponents behind it, you're seriously oot.

[Howey]

Harry Reid's Plan B: Probably to be hurried through soon. Looks like a watered down version of budget cuts that would have probably happened anyhow, and no increased revenue. Think December 2010 all over again...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/democrats-bash-cantor-over-debt-talks/2011/07/14/gIQAMDrPEI_story.html

[ekg]

wow...

the first paragraph is telling of YOUR beliefs...what you would imagine to be the perfect answer for the action...could be right...but idk it to be true

MY Beliefs? you mean the facts? well ok, I'm a bad person because I believe in facts.. you got me.

number two: shouldn't it be hard for any fucking body to get an increase after ten years of the limit being continuiously raised...jesus...in the middle of

a nightmare recession also...oh...of course not...the whoever is just out to get him...well of course they are...and it works both ways at all times...

with each new proposal or committee etc...everyone is always jockeying for position and leverage...

of course it should be hard, but it's never been this hard.. ever. It's routine, something that's done without objection every year.. something that's never done with the amout of blackmail and threats as is being done now.

the problem is there is a faction in  the gov't today that relishes the idea of destroying the country in order to rebuild it. This faction yells "Stop OBama, he's a socialist/Socialism is evil" while holding a sign that says "Obama, keep you hands off my medicare and SS".  This same faction raised the debt limit under 'their' president without hesitation.. but when another president, whom they've shouted down as a 'liar' during that presidents address to congress, or who just the other day said the only reason he was elected was because he was an, and I quote.. "articulate black man' and 'white guilt', came into office and put the wars,debts,and previous policies enacted by that other president on the books for the first time (because the wars,the medicare donut hole, and the tax cuts were never put on the books by the Bush admin or congress)..somehow he became the reason for all the debt when that is infact not true... yet this faction wants more than anything to ensure this 'articulate black man' doesn't get elected again by having any sort of economic recovery attached to him..

Nightmare recession indeed.. but that doesn't negate the extortion going on today by a select few who do not wish to see any progress being made.. and who in fact will profit if there is no progress made more so than they would is there was progress.. but having this person as the mouth-piece of their 'discussion on compromise' is somehow NOT counterproductive...

3. Objection !!!!

the defendant, hereby known in this thread as lilboh, which may or may not qualify as a mock, doesn't believe the one being objected can

provide evidence of the accusation and request that evidence be entered in, formally and published post haste !

I believe you are the one who referred yourself as taking on lilmike's side of things, thus you are the reason for the nickname..

playing the some what part of lil mike is gonna be tough...

you opened the door to your nickname in this thread.. and you also mocked Chuck by saying..

really...

i'm sure obama's ego is big enough to believe that...but you...really ?

so objection overruled.
 

[uselesslegs]

What I will never understand, is this desire to justify, encourage and support the detriment of the nations citizens (any nation's citizens) and by proxy it's economic stability, under (or for) the notion that seeking to enrich exponentially...no limits...somehow has no real consequences within the dynamic of a finite reality.

Unless people are fond of feudal systems, I can't wrap my head around why individuals would support and even help promote the continued downgrade of their own lives.

[Howey]

What I will never understand, is this desire to justify, encourage and support the detriment of the nations citizens (any nation's citizens) and by proxy it's economic stability, under (or for) the notion that seeking to enrich exponentially...no limits...somehow has no real consequences within the dynamic of a finite reality.

Unless people are fond of feudal systems, I can't wrap my head around why individuals would support and even help promote the continued downgrade of their own lives.

It's unfortunate, but as I've noted many times before, there's a large percentage of our citizenry who lack the...for lack of a better word - intelligence - to know what's happening.

Much like the feudal people of the past, they don't understand that what the overloads are promising them is not for their own good.

[betteroffhere]

MY Beliefs? you mean the facts? well ok, I'm a bad person because I believe in facts.. you got me.



of course it should be hard, but it's never been this hard.. ever. It's routine, something that's done without objection every year.. something that's never done with the amout of blackmail and threats as is being done now.

the problem is there is a faction in  the gov't today that relishes the idea of destroying the country in order to rebuild it. This faction yells "Stop OBama, he's a socialist/Socialism is evil" while holding a sign that says "Obama, keep you hands off my medicare and SS".  This same faction raised the debt limit under 'their' president without hesitation.. but when another president, whom they've shouted down as a 'liar' during that presidents address to congress, or who just the other day said the only reason he was elected was because he was an, and I quote.. "articulate black man' and 'white guilt', came into office and put the wars,debts,and previous policies enacted by that other president on the books for the first time (because the wars,the medicare donut hole, and the tax cuts were never put on the books by the Bush admin or congress)..somehow he became the reason for all the debt when that is infact not true... yet this faction wants more than anything to ensure this 'articulate black man' doesn't get elected again by having any sort of economic recovery attached to him..

Nightmare recession indeed.. but that doesn't negate the extortion going on today by a select few who do not wish to see any progress being made.. and who in fact will profit if there is no progress made more so than they would is there was progress.. but having this person as the mouth-piece of their 'discussion on compromise' is somehow NOT counterproductive...


I believe you are the one who referred yourself as taking on lilmike's side of things, thus you are the reason for the nickname..

you opened the door to your nickname in this thread.. and you also mocked Chuck by saying..

so objection overruled.
 

OH....ok then....sounds good to me

i'll but that for a quarter...




yikes !