Huckabee's "William Ayers"

[Howey]

Wait. Now that I'm thinking of it...you'll have to go to the muche to find the thread...wasn't it Huckabee's son that was involved in that dog-killing coverup at some kind of camp or something a few years ago?

Damn y'all! Do I have to do everything?


http://www.newsweek.com/2007/12/15/a-son-s-past-deeds-come-back-to-bite-huckabee.html

As Mike Huckabee gains in the polls, the former Arkansas governor is finding that his record in office is getting more scrutiny. One issue likely to get attention is his handling of a sensitive family matter: allegations that one of his sons was involved in the hanging of a stray dog at a Boy Scout camp in 1998. The incident led to the dismissal of David Huckabee, then 17, from his job as a counselor at Camp Pioneer in Hatfield, Ark. It also prompted the local prosecuting attorney— bombarded with complaints generated by a national animal-rights group—to write a letter to the Arkansas state police seeking help investigating whether David and another teenager had violated state animal-cruelty laws. The state police never granted the request, and no charges were ever filed. But John Bailey, then the director of Arkansas's state police, tells NEWSWEEK that Governor Huckabee's chief of staff and personal lawyer both leaned on him to write a letter officially denying the local prosecutor's request. Bailey, a career officer who had been appointed chief by Huckabee's Democratic predecessor, said he viewed the lawyer's intervention as improper and terminated the conversation. Seven months later, he was called into Huckabee's office and fired. "I've lost confidence in your ability to do your job," Bailey says Huckabee told him. One reason Huckabee cited was "I couldn't get you to help me with my son when I had that problem," according to Bailey. "Without question, [Huckabee] was making a conscious attempt to keep the state police from investigating his son," says I. C. Smith, the former FBI chief in Little Rock, who worked closely with Bailey and called him a "courageous" and "very solid" professional.

I forgot. For some reason, this picture is creepier than any picture I ever saw of Palin and her brood:

[Howey]

Huh. Remember this?

http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/huckabee-obama-not-scout-or-little-leaguer/

This is not a kid who grew up, you know, going to Boy Scout meetings and playing Little League baseball in a small town.

[ekg]

No, you're wrong.  I've already explained my position, and given you a freebie:  That this preacher or whatever he is is as kooky as you guys say he is.  So if the issue is not how kooky this guy is (I've given you that), and the issue isn't that this guy's a minister to Huckabee (Howey sorta/kinda admitted that he wasn't), then what is THE ISSUE I'm failing to address?

I don't have to play spelling nazi or any other tactic to avoid addressing the issue.   You pretended the issue is one thing (Huckabee's minister) than another (he's a nut!), so what else is left?  If the best answer you can come up with is go back and read everything again, even though the only issue's any of you has mentioned that this guy is kooky and/or Huckabee's preacher, is the REAL ISSUE some secret I'm supposed to divine?

Either tell me what the real issue is or don't, so far you've failed to make me interested in this topic other than to counter your accusations that I'm avoiding it.  If it's so important I'm sure Chris Matthews and Lawrence O'Donnell will let me know.

please.. that 'he's kooky' was a CYA throw-away and nothing more.. and it took you 3 pages to even make that much of an observation.. your only issue was the title until I mentioned you were playing your Kazzy-Game.. . you wanted nothing to do with this story for whatever reason.. but when it was Obama/Wright.. you went on for.. hell, I think you still do make little comments even now don't you?

Why haven't you asked "Does Huck believe in what this guy preaches".. like you did with Obama/Wright?  Wait, I know, because you know that answer and yes, he does... but not a peep on that issue, it's not essential enough, what is is that Howie labeled this thread "Huck's Preacher"

Why haven't you made some nefarious links between this guy and Huck like you did/do with Obama,Wright and even Farrakhan.. You don't have to twist,bend and squint your eyes just right to see a link between them.. it's right there, Huck wants kids indoctrinated by him and all Americans held at gun point and forced to listen to him preach..

Obama/Wright was such a HUGE deal for you.. even tho Obama repudiated the man in public, you still wonder.. hmmm, maybe Obama really hates white people like his preacher did, I mean he did stay there for 20 years and all..

But instead of anything like that or even a piddly 'why is the msm giving Huck a free pass on this stuff ( ya know, like you did with Obama/Wright)" you give a 'he's kooky' reply when cornered as a cya,throwaway answer and then focus on what the issue is for you, and that's the title of the thread  ..

no, sorry.. I was not wrong...  now you can go back to diverting the attention for 3 more pages on the great error of a title that Howie gave his thread..

[lil mike]

please.. that 'he's kooky' was a CYA throw-away and nothing more.. and it took you 3 pages to even make that much of an observation.. your only issue was the title until I mentioned you were playing your Kazzy-Game.. . you wanted nothing to do with this story for whatever reason.. but when it was Obama/Wright.. you went on for.. hell, I think you still do make little comments even now don't you?

Why haven't you asked "Does Huck believe in what this guy preaches".. like you did with Obama/Wright?  Wait, I know, because you know that answer and yes, he does... but not a peep on that issue, it's not essential enough, what is is that Howie labeled this thread "Huck's Preacher"

Why haven't you made some nefarious links between this guy and Huck like you did/do with Obama,Wright and even Farrakhan.. You don't have to twist,bend and squint your eyes just right to see a link between them.. it's right there, Huck wants kids indoctrinated by him and all Americans held at gun point and forced to listen to him preach..

Obama/Wright was such a HUGE deal for you.. even tho Obama repudiated the man in public, you still wonder.. hmmm, maybe Obama really hates white people like his preacher did, I mean he did stay there for 20 years and all..

But instead of anything like that or even a piddly 'why is the msm giving Huck a free pass on this stuff ( ya know, like you did with Obama/Wright)" you give a 'he's kooky' reply when cornered as a cya,throwaway answer and then focus on what the issue is for you, and that's the title of the thread  ..

no, sorry.. I was not wrong...  now you can go back to diverting the attention for 3 more pages on the great error of a title that Howie gave his thread..

Yes, you were wrong.

I didn't make the Wright connection, Howey did, so don't act like I made up that corollary between the two preachers. If you didn't think the connection between Wright and Obama, who had a 20 year relationship, sat in the pews of that church, gave Wright credit for leading him to Christianity, dedicated his book to him, and could, "no more disown [Wright] than I can the black community," and "has been like a family to me," (whew) was important then, why do you think Huck and this Preacher is more important now?

You asked none of the questions of Wright that you are asking me of Huck.

Yes he did eventually throw Wright under the bus...finally!  After this finally came to a political head and even the MSM had to notice.

But you can't seem to take a win when I give it to you.  Why would you consider me agreeing with you that he's kooky a throw away CYA?  What do I have to cover my ass about?  I agree with you that the guy is kooky. 

What I don't agree with is that this guy is more important to, or has a more comprehensive relationship to Huckabee than Obama/Wright. Why it's important to you guys to establish that link, I don't really know.  It's like you are trying to draw your very own Glenn Beck chalkboard of weird connections.  Using your logic, Obama must be a commie because of Anita Dunn and Van Jones. 

I don't think Huckabee is even running for President, so your pre-emptive smear seems like a waste of time, but even if I play along, you still have not addressed the REAL issue.  The one that I asked about in my last comment which you ignored.  What is the relationship with Huckabee and Kooky Preacher?


Are they closer than Obama/Wright?

As close?

Not as close but still tight?

Or, have they met a few times and kooky preacher has been on Huckabees show?

I find it hard to beleive that if Huckabee and Kooky Preacher were as tight as you are implying*, this wouldn't have come out in 2008.  Why was this not an issue in 2008, when Hucabee was actually running for President and was the actual number 2 in the Republican Primaries?


*and so far that's what this seems to be, implication and insinuation.  Why can't you guys come out and clearly state what you think the relationship is?  So far only that he is Huckabee's Wright, which based on the evidence, seems ridiculous.

[ekg]

Yes, you were wrong.

I didn't make the Wright connection, Howey did, so don't act like I made up that corollary between the two preachers.

I'm not talking about the 'wright connection'. .. I'm talking about you only addressing the decision Howie made to title his thread 'Hucks Preacher"..your issue has been to argue that point and only that point..

Not quite, but I don't see where this guy is Huck's preacher.

Is this guy Huckabee's minister?

I've never heard of this guy.  But you said that he was Huckabee's preacher.  So the issue of how crazy or how much of a loon he is is not really relevant to Huckabee unless he's Huck's pastor since there are plenty of crazy preachers running around.  If you want to compare him to Wright, and you do since you brought him up, then he has to be someone's preacher.  We would have never talked about Wright in 2008 if he hadn't been Obama's preacher for 20 years.  So show me Huckabee's preacher, or any major candidates preacher, but for this guy, who gives a fuck?

The subject line made me think you had a real story.

Further digging shows you don't have anything.

Why do you keep dodging around the essential issue?  If Wright was just a pastor that Obama had known, that wouldn't be an issue.  But Wright was Obama's pastor.

You initially claimed this guy was Huckabee's pastor.  He isn't.  Game over.

over and over again.. What Huck said, not an issue with you.. whether this guy is nuttier than Wright, not an issue... whether it's a pretty huge story to have a presidential candidate advocating indoctrination of children and forced at gun point to listen to someone extreme visions, again.. not an issue for you.. the only issue is to ignore all of that and harp on whether or not Howies thread title is 100% literal and factual instead of just an easy title to make..

If you didn't think the connection between Wright and Obama, who had a 20 year relationship, sat in the pews of that church, gave Wright credit for leading him to Christianity, dedicated his book to him, and could, "no more disown [Wright] than I can the black community," and "has been like a family to me," (whew) was important then, why do you think Huck and this Preacher is more important now?

I don't seem to remember Obama  insisting.. "that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:  and then saying "I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. " about Wright even after those 20 years.. But I do remember  the Wright/Obama being a huge thing for you.. it was just more proof he was inline with the Bill Ayers terrorists right?

but you can't even agree that this is even important...

What I don't agree with is that this guy is more important to, or has a more comprehensive relationship to Huckabee than Obama/Wright.

 can you..

Really? Huck's own words don't prove any of that you?

wait, you haven't even addressed that yet, because you're still on the argument that he's not really Huck's preacher, therefore, since you've proven that literally wrong, you are somehow correct in everything else..

again... you're not...

Why it's important to you guys to establish that link, I don't really know.  It's like you are trying to draw your very own Glenn Beck chalkboard of weird connections.  Using your logic, Obama must be a commie because of Anita Dunn and Van Jones. 

actually it's a discussion that would have lasted about 4 posts had you not continue to argue the title of the thread instead of ignoring the words that came out of Huck's mouth for his vision for America..

so there really was no 'importance'.. just trying to teach you how to engage in an actual conversation with people again, instead of continuing along in the 'kazz-bot' mode you've seem to have fallen in our debate-hiatus..

I don't think Huckabee is even running for President, so your pre-emptive smear seems like a waste of time, but even if I play along, you still have not addressed the REAL issue.  The one that I asked about in my last comment which you ignored.  What is the relationship with Huckabee and Kooky Preacher?

ok, I'll post the relationship again.. I assumed you caught it the 1st time you read it or even the next time after you said you read it again..

Though he “holds no advanced degrees and does not teach at any legitimate institution,” Barton is no small figure in conservative politics. He was invited by Fox News host Glenn Beck and Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-MN) to teach as a “scholar” on American history. At the conference, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich said that “every time he hears Barton speak, he learns something new.” But Right Wing Watch’s Kyle Mantyla captured the most outrageous endorsement yet. Introduced by Barton, Gov. Mike Huckabee (R-AR) insisted that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:

HUCKABEE: I don’t know anyone in America who is a more effective communicator [than David Barton.] I just wish that every single young person in America would be able to be under his tutelage and understand something about who we really are as a nation. I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. And I think our country would be better for it. I wish it’d happen.

that is the relationship.. he wants every American, at gun point if necessary, to listen to this guys message..

Are they closer than Obama/Wright?

As close?

Not as close but still tight?

Or, have they met a few times and kooky preacher has been on Huckabees show?

I find it hard to beleive that if Huckabee and Kooky Preacher were as tight as you are implying*, this wouldn't have come out in 2008.  Why was this not an issue in 2008, when Hucabee was actually running for President and was the actual number 2 in the Republican Primaries?


*and so far that's what this seems to be, implication and insinuation.  Why can't you guys come out and clearly state what you think the relationship is?  So far only that he is Huckabee's Wright, which based on the evidence, seems ridiculous.

Oh I think his words speak for themselves on what the relationship is..  as for them being 'close' or only having met a few times? well, with that kind of proclamation he's making, I would hope he'd know something about the guy.. wouldn't you?

are they as close as wright/obama? again, I don't recall Obama, after being as close as you say he was with Wright, ever said anything like this about him, So I just assume Huck's as close, if not closer... wouldn't you?

[Howey]

I'm not talking about the 'wright connection'. .. I'm talking about you only addressing the decision Howie made to title his thread 'Hucks Preacher"..your issue has been to argue that point and only that point..

over and over again.. What Huck said, not an issue with you.. whether this guy is nuttier than Wright, not an issue... whether it's a pretty huge story to have a presidential candidate advocating indoctrination of children and forced at gun point to listen to someone extreme visions, again.. not an issue for you.. the only issue is to ignore all of that and harp on whether or not Howies thread title is 100% literal and factual instead of just an easy title to make..

I don't seem to remember Obama  insisting.. "that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:  and then saying "I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. " about Wright even after those 20 years.. But I do remember  the Wright/Obama being a huge thing for you.. it was just more proof he was inline with the Bill Ayers terrorists right?

but you can't even agree that this is even important...

 can you..

Really? Huck's own words don't prove any of that you?

wait, you haven't even addressed that yet, because you're still on the argument that he's not really Huck's preacher, therefore, since you've proven that literally wrong, you are somehow correct in everything else..

again... you're not...

actually it's a discussion that would have lasted about 4 posts had you not continue to argue the title of the thread instead of ignoring the words that came out of Huck's mouth for his vision for America..

so there really was no 'importance'.. just trying to teach you how to engage in an actual conversation with people again, instead of continuing along in the 'kazz-bot' mode you've seem to have fallen in our debate-hiatus..

ok, I'll post the relationship again.. I assumed you caught it the 1st time you read it or even the next time after you said you read it again..

that is the relationship.. he wants every American, at gun point if necessary, to listen to this guys message..


Oh I think his words speak for themselves on what the relationship is..  as for them being 'close' or only having met a few times? well, with that kind of proclamation he's making, I would hope he'd know something about the guy.. wouldn't you?

are they as close as wright/obama? again, I don't recall Obama, after being as close as you say he was with Wright, ever said anything like this about him, So I just assume Huck's as close, if not closer... wouldn't you?

Obama's daughter* on Wright: "He helped me believe in a spiritual being."

Huckabee's son David on Barton: "He helped me believe in him by pointing a gun at me. Then I took that gun and shot my neighbor's dog."










*Note: Obama's daughter didn't say that. I was trying to make a funny joke and bring up Huckabee's crazy dog-killing son since y'all are ignoring the fact that only a crazy could raise a crazy like that.

And really, the picture? Not a peep???

[ekg]

eh, it's a dorky fam picture.. I'm sure we all have one of them in our past somewhere

[uselesslegs]

I wonder if the photographer convinced them that the big house in the back ground would be slimming...OH!

[Howey]

eh, it's a dorky fam picture.. I'm sure we all have one of them in our past somewhere

Are you kidding? My dad was AF, remember? If he'd tried to make us kids at 17, 18 or whatever dress up in red, white and blue he would have....no. He would have never asked.


And look at that poor dog! It's like he's saying "Get me the hell outta here before fatass tries to hang me too!"

[clc]

Damn y'all! Do I have to do everything?


http://www.newsweek.com/2007/12/15/a-son-s-past-deeds-come-back-to-bite-huckabee.html

I forgot. For some reason, this picture is creepier than any picture I ever saw of Palin and her brood:

Holy shit, that dog is creepy looking! It looks like it has shark teeth Baraka from Mortal Kombat

[Howey]

The DOG'S creepy?


Sheesh, I give up on y'all!

[clc]

The DOG'S creepy?


Sheesh, I give up on y'all!

The entire family looks like every single one you'd find in a Perkin's breakfast buffet, but that damn dog looks possessed.

[lil mike]

I'm not talking about the 'wright connection'. .. I'm talking about you only addressing the decision Howie made to title his thread 'Hucks Preacher"..your issue has been to argue that point and only that point..

over and over again.. What Huck said, not an issue with you.. whether this guy is nuttier than Wright, not an issue... whether it's a pretty huge story to have a presidential candidate advocating indoctrination of children and forced at gun point to listen to someone extreme visions, again.. not an issue for you.. the only issue is to ignore all of that and harp on whether or not Howies thread title is 100% literal and factual instead of just an easy title to make..

I don't seem to remember Obama  insisting.. "that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:  and then saying "I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. " about Wright even after those 20 years.. But I do remember  the Wright/Obama being a huge thing for you.. it was just more proof he was inline with the Bill Ayers terrorists right?

but you can't even agree that this is even important...

 can you..

Really? Huck's own words don't prove any of that you?

wait, you haven't even addressed that yet, because you're still on the argument that he's not really Huck's preacher, therefore, since you've proven that literally wrong, you are somehow correct in everything else..

again... you're not...

actually it's a discussion that would have lasted about 4 posts had you not continue to argue the title of the thread instead of ignoring the words that came out of Huck's mouth for his vision for America..

so there really was no 'importance'.. just trying to teach you how to engage in an actual conversation with people again, instead of continuing along in the 'kazz-bot' mode you've seem to have fallen in our debate-hiatus..

ok, I'll post the relationship again.. I assumed you caught it the 1st time you read it or even the next time after you said you read it again..

that is the relationship.. he wants every American, at gun point if necessary, to listen to this guys message..


Oh I think his words speak for themselves on what the relationship is..  as for them being 'close' or only having met a few times? well, with that kind of proclamation he's making, I would hope he'd know something about the guy.. wouldn't you?

are they as close as wright/obama? again, I don't recall Obama, after being as close as you say he was with Wright, ever said anything like this about him, So I just assume Huck's as close, if not closer... wouldn't you?

Finally.  Even though it took 4 pages, you finally told me.  The REAL issue is what Huckabee agreed with this guy about.

OK actually that wasnt' your real issue, it's merely the fall back one.  It's amazing that it took this long, but rather than just being straight, you guys wanted to run round and round, trying to hang on to a false meme.  Even when I agreed with you it just seemed to irritate you more.

I've zero interest in game playing.  If you have an issue, just plainly say what it is.  What I think you wanted the issue to be was to just past this guy off as Huckabee's preacher.  Thats why no one could dare agree with me that he wasn't.

Then the attack was on me for trying to "dodge" the issue.   I just wonder how long you would have repeated this idea about him being Huckabee's preacher if I hadn't called you guys on it.

[Howey]

"that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:  and then saying "I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. "

Finally.  Even though it took 4 pages, you finally told me.  The REAL issue is what Huckabee agreed with this guy about.

Ummm...since you like to bold/italicize stuff to make your point...I did the same thing in my very first post:

Iowa played host to two right-wing rodeos last weekend, the Conservative Principles Conference and the Rediscover God in America conference. While many of the GOP 2012 presidential hopefuls graced both stages, only at Rediscover God in America did they offer Americans two revealing facts: “America should be governed by biblical law,” and that discredited historian David Barton is a genius.

A former Texas GOP official, David Barton is a “Christian historical revisionist” who contends that “the United States of America is a Christian nation” and the separation of church and state is a “liberal myth.” He is also one of the most radical Tenthers in the country who believes the federal highway system is unconstitutional. So radical was his view that even the Tenth Amendment Center disavowed his federal highway theory.

Though he “holds no advanced degrees and does not teach at any legitimate institution,” Barton is no small figure in conservative politics. He was invited by Fox News host Glenn Beck and Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-MN) to teach as a “scholar” on American history. At the conference, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich said that “every time he hears Barton speak, he learns something new.” But Right Wing Watch’s Kyle Mantyla captured the most outrageous endorsement yet. Introduced by Barton, Gov. Mike Huckabee (R-AR) insisted that children need to be “under his tutelage” and said that every American should be forced “at gun point” to “listen to every David Barton message”:

HUCKABEE: I don’t know anyone in America who is a more effective communicator [than David Barton.] I just wish that every single young person in America would be able to be under his tutelage and understand something about who we really are as a nation. I almost wish that there would be something like a simultaneous telecast and all Americans would be forced, forced — at gun point no less — to listen to every David Barton message. And I think our country would be better for it. I wish it’d happen.

On the next page, although I didn't bold/italicize it, I made my point very clear - both on your stubborn refusal to get the point and on the real point of this conversation:

Funny how Mike ignores everything said about Barton...only to declare "But he's not really Huckabee's preacher!"

The guy preaches hate out of every orifice, Huckabee tells his people we should all listen to Barton with shotguns pointed at us...but he's not an influence on Huck?

Sheesh...

You continued this obstinate refusal to get the point...

So the issue of how crazy or how much of a loon he is is not really relevant to Huckabee unless he's Huck's pastor since there are plenty of crazy preachers running around.

...by naively insuinating that the only type of person who could influence Huckabee is a preacher...

We would have never talked about Wright in 2008 if he hadn't been Obama's preacher for 20 years.

We may or may not have because we didn't know about Obama or Wright (to a great extent) until then. Of course, you always had William Ayers to fall back on.



AHA!

Hold on...

[Howey]

AHA!

Hold on...

Ok. Now do you get the point?

Huckabee's "William Ayers"